tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7691251033406320222.post6037742762701699980..comments2024-03-26T04:19:38.862-07:00Comments on kitchen table math, the sequel: reading workshopCatherine Johnsonhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/03347093496361370174noreply@blogger.comBlogger96125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7691251033406320222.post-74642079255230672862010-04-08T13:23:41.705-07:002010-04-08T13:23:41.705-07:00Thanks, Cassy!Thanks, Cassy!Catherine Johnsonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03347093496361370174noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7691251033406320222.post-29246281938920102752010-04-08T13:17:17.508-07:002010-04-08T13:17:17.508-07:00Random IB thoughts from a parent of a freshman... ...Random IB thoughts from a parent of a freshman... <br /><br />I've been told that the MYP (Middle Years Program) is a "philosophy" whereas 11th & 12th grade program (DP for Diploma Program) is an actual curriculum. Here's the school's <a href="http://schoolweb.psdschools.org/phs/communities/IB/index.html" rel="nofollow">IB Mission Statement</a>. My freshman rarely has homework. He's a bright kid, a bit of a slacker, but I'm not worried too much about his future college choices. His goal is a good engineering school like CSU or the School of Mines.<br /><br />My understanding is that IB gets more challenging as you age through the program.<br /><br />The things that the IB juniors and seniors have been doing can be amazing. My husband and I both advise 11th grade IB students reflecting on their outside activities that meet requirements for Creativity, Action, and Service (CAS). This is that mandatory, outside schoolwork stuff like sports, volunteer work, etc...that IB requires. Of course, that's all on top of schoolwork and a personal project that requires 100+ hours of work. How students fit in Eagle Scout projects, 2 or three plays a year, tutoring elementary kids, cross-country, mountain climbing and working with handicapped equestrians is beyond me. It's a lot of work being a well-rounded citizen.<br /><br />Back to my son... After six years of Core Knowledge and two years of a Classical Education, he is, for the first time in his post-elementary education, getting something other than Greek & Roman history. They're studying African history & literature. <br /><br />If you look at the <a href="http://www.ibo.org/myp/curriculum/index.cfm" rel="nofollow">IB MYP website</a>, it seems to be <b>180 degrees away from a classical education</b>:<br /><br /><i> The overall philosophy of the programme is expressed through three fundamental concepts that support and strengthen all areas of the curriculum. These concepts are based on:<br /><br /> * intercultural awareness<br /> * holistic learning<br /> * communication.</i><br /><br />He has 7 classes; all except Geo Space are IB courses:<br /><br />World Geography & History<br />Classical/World literature<br />Spanish 1<br />Geo Space Science<br />Biology 1<br />Algebra 2<br /><br />He's also taking a class that I would call "shop" but the school refers to as "Engineering Design Technology I". Basically, my son has designed a 3-D object in a CAD program & printed it with a 3D printer, worked a metal lathe, a plasma cutter and will be welding soon. This fulfills the art requirement. He.loves.it.<br /><br />Is the coursework as rigorous as I would like? I'm not really sure. Because most work is done at school, <b>I don't see much of it.</b> I'm not really sure what the school does to make Algebra 2 from a regular textbook IB friendly. The IB website lists minimal requirements:<br /><br /><i>Mathematics in the Middle Years Programme aims to provide students with an appreciation of the usefulness, power and beauty of the subject.<br /><br />One aspect of this is the awareness that mathematics is a universal language with diverse applications. The Middle Years Programme promotes an understanding of how cultural, societal and historical influences from a variety of cultures have shaped mathematical thought.<br /><br />Schools are required to develop schemes of work according to a framework that includes five branches of mathematics:<br /><br /> * number<br /> * algebra<br /> * geometry and trigonometry<br /> * statistics and probability<br /> * discrete mathematics.<br /></i>Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01239123267984420065noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7691251033406320222.post-85032386244354868142010-04-08T13:14:11.983-07:002010-04-08T13:14:11.983-07:00off-topic, but I'm curious how a group of babi...off-topic, but I'm curious how a group of babies came to be randomly assigned to adoptive families.<br /><br />I didn't see an explanation early in the paper & don't have the patience to search for it right now.Catherine Johnsonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03347093496361370174noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7691251033406320222.post-2828302609135306612010-04-08T12:13:22.164-07:002010-04-08T12:13:22.164-07:00CW,
First, I was quoting Ken DeRosa.
Second, yes...CW,<br /><br />First, I was quoting Ken DeRosa.<br /><br />Second, yes, the study is "old", but it's still consistent with every other study out there but one that shows a standard deviation of difference in achievement scores, no matter how you measure them. The "but one" is even older--and it's the only study Flynn's got. It's from post WWII black GIs in Germany, who married German women. Not exactly "new". Yet people trot that out all the time, and don't cite the selection criteria there that might make it nonrepresentative (the black GIs having higher IQs than other black on average; the blacks marrying German women being a significantly different group, the women who found such men attractive being nonrepresentative in Germany such a short time after Nazism, etc.)<br /><br />Third, you don't know much about Minnesota. There's no racial diversity in the suburbs here even now. The racial diversity is in the cities, but it's "diverse", a euphemism for "not integrated". The cities, which are overwhelmingly liberal have white high SES and black and hispanic and southeast asian low SES populations. It's still the high SES whites doing the adoption, and the neighborhoods they are adopted into are still white.<br /><br />Yes, attitudes have changed. The IQ studies done are still consistent with all of the other ones done. You can keep trying to find loopholes against this uncomfortable truth, but reality keeps being uncomfortable.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7691251033406320222.post-53492032642315283282010-04-08T11:15:49.773-07:002010-04-08T11:15:49.773-07:00Catherine- I should've clarified that it was t...Catherine- I should've clarified that it was the IQ portion of the transracial adoption study that is too much of a political hot potato. And specifically looking at blacks adopted into white families. <br /><br />I wouldn't touch that with a 10 foot pole if I were a social science researcher. Too hard to secure funding, too great a risk of not being able to publish the results if they wound up similar to the previous study. Not saying that I think they would, but I wouldn't stake my academic reputation on the issue.Crimson Wifehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03254830856234479999noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7691251033406320222.post-60070089945280780772010-04-08T10:26:51.570-07:002010-04-08T10:26:51.570-07:00Blogger has been behaving strangely lately. Someti...Blogger has been behaving strangely lately. Sometimes it seems like my comments don't post. I can find them in one spot and not another. After a while I see it no matter how I get to it. I've been saving my comments lately.SteveHhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03956560674752399562noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7691251033406320222.post-74171963048971039772010-04-08T10:25:37.647-07:002010-04-08T10:25:37.647-07:00Turns out I was wrong - obesity is connected to yo...Turns out I was wrong - obesity is connected to your biological parents. It's drinking and smoking you get from your adoptive parents.<br /><br />I kind of love it that adoptive parents (apparently) have Total Power to transmit bad habits to their kids. <br /><br /><i>I use a new data set of Korean-American adoptees who, as infants, were randomly assigned to families in the U.S. I examine the treatment effects from being assigned to a high income family, a high education family or a family with four or more children. I calculate the transmission of income, education and health characteristics from adoptive parents to adoptees. I then compare these coefficients of transmission to the analogous coefficients for biological children in the same families, and to children raised by their biological parents in other data sets. Having a college educated mother increases an adoptee's probability of graduating from college by 7 percentage points, but raises a biological child's probability of graduating from college by 26 percentage points. In contrast, transmission of drinking and smoking behavior from parents to children is as strong for adoptees as for non-adoptees. For height, obesity, and income, transmission coefficients are significantly higher for non-adoptees than for adoptees. In this sample, sibling gender composition does not appear to affect adoptee outcomes nor does the mix of adoptee siblings versus biological siblings.</i><br /><br /><a href="http://www.nber.org/papers/w10894" rel="nofollow">WHAT HAPPENS WHEN WE RANDOMLY ASSIGN CHILDREN TO FAMILIES?</a><br />Bruce Sacerdote<br />October 22, 2004Catherine Johnsonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03347093496361370174noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7691251033406320222.post-14714875196349207852010-04-08T10:15:25.223-07:002010-04-08T10:15:25.223-07:00grr...just lost a commentgrr...just lost a commentCatherine Johnsonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03347093496361370174noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7691251033406320222.post-13723923683847995982010-04-08T09:55:30.325-07:002010-04-08T09:55:30.325-07:00"Once IB was branded elitist..."
I woul..."Once IB was branded elitist..."<br /><br />I would be interested to know if they feel the same way about AP classes. In my niece's school in MI, a number of IB classes use AP classes. They might adjust a few things for each type of student, however. She loved IB, but I haven't asked her for details.<br /><br />I don't like the all or nothing nature of the program, but then again, my neice's school has either 2 or 3 levels of commitment. And, if you cross-list the AP and IB classes (I don't know if the IB people like that), there shouldn't be much of an additional cost. But, if these other IB classes have few students, then they would be easy targets for cutting. If the program has full classes, then I don't know what they would save by cutting them. The students don't disappear.SteveHhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03956560674752399562noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7691251033406320222.post-50114729882159165292010-04-08T09:37:24.747-07:002010-04-08T09:37:24.747-07:00Rocky - what are your thoughts on IB?
I'm lee...Rocky - what are your thoughts on IB?<br /><br />I'm leery of the program; I worry it's been or in the process of being captured by constructivists. <br /><br />Who writes the curriculum?<br /><br />Do we know?<br /><br />I've looked through their website...<br /><br />When I looked at the middle school IB program a few years ago I didn't like it at all. <br /><br />Plus the calculus course isn't good. I know that from David Klein & also from an engineering student I met who took IB calculus. He was contemptuous; said he had to write a paper & then teach himself a bunch of content the course didn't cover.Catherine Johnsonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03347093496361370174noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7691251033406320222.post-3222148241060846502010-04-08T09:34:35.807-07:002010-04-08T09:34:35.807-07:00Crimson Wife - actually, I think there is a new st...Crimson Wife - actually, I think there is a new study - isn't there?? I was looking at it just the other day.<br /><br />All I remember was that everything was genetic EXCEPT .... junk food consumption, I think! If your adoptive parents were overweight & your biological parents were thin, you're overweight. <br /><br />sheesh<br /><br />I should go look it up, if I can remember where I saw it & what it was. <br /><br />What I remember at the moment was thinking that diet-and-weight-loss in our contemporary environment is impossible.Catherine Johnsonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03347093496361370174noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7691251033406320222.post-39528944607820075902010-04-08T09:32:10.753-07:002010-04-08T09:32:10.753-07:00Once IB was branded elitist, and a theft of resour...<i>Once IB was branded elitist, and a theft of resources from the disadvantaged, public discussion for IB ceased.</i><br /><br />I am HORRIFIED.<br /><br />This is another 'always worse than you think' moment for me; I've never heard of one group of parents/citizens going after another group in this way.Catherine Johnsonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03347093496361370174noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7691251033406320222.post-68137183990343682872010-04-08T09:11:41.946-07:002010-04-08T09:11:41.946-07:00"What if we had some student achievement data...<i>"What if we had some student achievement data from placing low-SES infants in high-SES households, replete with highly educated parents and lots of lots of earned income, and allowing the high-SES parents to nurture the low-SES children over their childhood? Might that settle the issue? In fact we do have just this sort data from various adoption studies, for example...the Minnesota Transracial Adoption Study."</i><br /><br />You do realize that this is a really OLD study? When these black children were adopted by white families there was a LOT more racial discrimination than there is today. A black child growing up in the late 1960's in an white neighborhood had a very different experience than a black child growing up in today's more diverse suburbs will have. <br /><br />Unfortunately we don't have any more recent data because it's too much of a political hot potato for researchers.Crimson Wifehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03254830856234479999noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7691251033406320222.post-37195014362891049362010-04-08T01:34:48.452-07:002010-04-08T01:34:48.452-07:00I’m beginning to think that the racial/ethnic issu...<i>I’m beginning to think that the racial/ethnic issue is THE dominant force in public schools, driving [...] elimination of tracking and gifted/honors classes</i><br /><br />That's certainly not what's happening in my neck of the woods. My district recently decided against a G/T program because it was politically "unsafe"...the school board worried about powerful parents who would scream bloody murder if THEIR child wasn't placed in the program. (And yes, these were politically active white middle and upper-middle class suburban parents.)Hainishnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7691251033406320222.post-72425554498428308552010-04-07T19:58:19.113-07:002010-04-07T19:58:19.113-07:00a nonremedial child sit in 5 study halls
That'...<i>a nonremedial child sit in 5 study halls</i><br /><br />That's silly. Is there no fast track to graduation?<br /><br />(not a big fan of International Baccalaureate)rockynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7691251033406320222.post-39088288968786717812010-04-07T10:59:58.089-07:002010-04-07T10:59:58.089-07:00At best, one can work for more school choices and ...<i> At best, one can work for more school choices and hope that those other schools have a clue.</i><br /><br />I respectfully disagree, though I would also love to see more school choice. Or at least, I disagree in the sense that I think it is worth looking into the judicial angle from a general ed point of view. But no need for me to belabor the point--if I'm able to get more info that backs up my gut feeling, I will come back and share that.Lauranoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7691251033406320222.post-30128671117679149882010-04-07T10:51:53.010-07:002010-04-07T10:51:53.010-07:00Our local high school is following that route. Al...Our local high school is following that route. All students are supposed to create an individual education plan with a teacher. This is a goal for the district. It sounds like the same thing. <br /><br />It is silly. Due to space constraints, most students don't get the schedule they request. How one is supposed to construct a plan for education when your class schedule is hit-or-miss?Cranberrynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7691251033406320222.post-4033039143919723432010-04-07T10:42:39.942-07:002010-04-07T10:42:39.942-07:00"gifted IEP route"
As I mentioned, ever..."gifted IEP route"<br /><br />As I mentioned, everyone in our schools now has their own IEP. It's completely silly and talks a lot about what the student expects from him/herself. But they proclaim that everyone has an IEP. Everything gets twisted around. Words, meanings, and even math gets twisted around and we are told that what they do provides understanding and critical thinking.<br /><br />At best, one can work for more school choices and hope that those other schools have a clue.SteveHhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03956560674752399562noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7691251033406320222.post-58870302137641545142010-04-07T10:14:50.735-07:002010-04-07T10:14:50.735-07:00In our area, some have tried to claim that G&T...<i>In our area, some have tried to claim that G&T students have "special" needs just like many other kids. The problem with G&T is how to define the low end of the 'T'</i><br /><br />There are states that have something called a "gifted IEP," which is supposed to do what you are describing, but I think, for the reason you list, as well as others, it's very hard to enforce.<br /><br />I'm thinking that the gifted IEP route is the wrong tactic, and unnecessary. Because, again, we need to remember that special education law is actually based on a Supreme Court interpretation of regular education rights. <br /><br />There's no need to base general ed (whether gifted, average, or "slow," but not classified) rights on special ed law (I think--as I said, I'm going to look into this and ask some friends who are lawyers for help), since the precedent has to do with regular ed law.<br /><br />As Catherine brought up, No Child Left Behind is based on this idea, but even that is a political work-around, not a judicial challenge of public education's constitutionality. Why not go directly to the judicial route (though I understand that it's not something that should be done lightly)?<br /><br />I know it's probably unlikely, but I'm wondering if it could potentially be a viable point of entry.Lauranoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7691251033406320222.post-6630837209944879932010-04-07T10:05:19.624-07:002010-04-07T10:05:19.624-07:00I’m beginning to think that the racial/ethnic issu...I’m beginning to think that the racial/ethnic issue is THE dominant force in public schools, driving pretty much every decision: mainstreaming, full inclusion, heterogeneous classrooms, elimination of tracking and gifted/honors classes, social promotion, focus on left end of Bell curve, refusal of accelerate, curriculum decisions (weak lit, writing, sciences, humanities, Everyday Math), instructional methods (groupwork, discovery, peer tutoring), even AP/IB choices. “All” can “succeed” in English or humanities, so must have more of that, but sciences are “too white and Asian”, so they can be cut (cue recent Berkeley HS decision) etc. etc.momof4noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7691251033406320222.post-88387424870158666452010-04-07T09:35:52.023-07:002010-04-07T09:35:52.023-07:00"But now, I'm wondering if the parents of..."But now, I'm wondering if the parents of non-remedial students could make a case, based on Brown, that their kids are not getting a basic education from the school system."<br /><br />I think Catherine talked about that long ago. It would be nice to use that angle, but I don't know how it would work out.<br /><br />In our area, some have tried to claim that G&T students have "special" needs just like many other kids. The problem with G&T is how to define the low end of the 'T'. Many of the kids in that area are just hard workers. But then what about the kids in the middle, especially those right below that cutoff? Don't they have special needs too? You could probably make a better case for just a gifted program, but I don't think that would go over very well.<br /><br />Our state says that there will be no money for G&T. Everyone will use full inclusion and somehow get it to work. Of course, this changes in math in 7th grade. Enough kids make it to honors classes in H.S. that they will continue with this model of education for a long time.<br /><br />Our schools claim that this is more than "basic" because they exceed all state expectations and are improving. They even have our kids develop individual educational plans. It's hard to have any sort of discussion when they're on a completely different planet.<br /><br />It's interesting that most people would agree that each student has special needs, and that parents know best what those needs are. Then, they expect that all of those needs can be met in a full inclusion environment where everyone is tracked by age. Some of these people are strongly against charter schools where parents might find a better "needs" match for their child.SteveHhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03956560674752399562noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7691251033406320222.post-82900342593193802222010-04-07T09:13:18.734-07:002010-04-07T09:13:18.734-07:00Well, I for one have just placed a bunch of holds ...Well, I for one have just placed a bunch of holds through inter-library loan for books on special education law and No Child Left Behind, and plan on looking into this.Lauranoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7691251033406320222.post-78698149237217873242010-04-07T09:05:15.662-07:002010-04-07T09:05:15.662-07:00Define basic. Is it functioning on grade level, i....<i>Define basic. Is it functioning on grade level, i.e., doing what a 5th grader is expected to do, when you're 10? </i><br /><br />This is exactly what I'm wondering, from a legal standpoint. <br /><br />What, as parents and as citizens, might we demand if we were the ones insisting that the schools apply the principles behind Brown to all kids?<br /><br />Could we insist on schooling instead of babysitting/indoctrination? Could we insist on clear goals for each grade level? What could be done for kids who meet those goals before the end of the year, or those who fail to meet them by the end of the year (even if they are not classified)?Lauranoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7691251033406320222.post-86626408438487700702010-04-07T08:28:35.212-07:002010-04-07T08:28:35.212-07:00Define basic. Is it functioning on grade level, i...Define basic. Is it functioning on grade level, i.e., doing what a 5th grader is expected to do, when you're 10? If that's the definition, then what should one do with children who enter their 5th grade year above grade level? What are systems legally required to do?<br /><br />Our school system doesn't have G&T, so that's never been an option for us. The school's answer has been, in general, that strong students should tutor weak students. Of course, a kid who's bored out of his gourd may not look like a strong student, because compliance with a rules based system may not make any sense to a bright 10 year old. Why should he pretend to make an effort, when the homework takes no effort? If the class matter is too easy, it will have no value for him -- or as much value as a worksheet requiring adults to name the days of the week would have for adults.<br /><br />If a basic education means the provision of teachers and academic work, why must it fit the age, not the kid's academic level? Why must a 10 year old functioning at a 7th grade level attend 5th grade classes? <br /><br />This is vitally important for our society. Just this week I saw an article citing a national shortage of nuclear engineers. [http://www.boston.com/news/nation/washington/articles/2010/04/03/alarm_over_shortage_of_nuclear_experts/] <br /><br />I submit that the kid who gets As on class tests, but doesn't hand in his homework, needs more interesting subject matter. Every student should have the privilege of being unable to ace tests. If students are passing tests with 100%, they aren't correctly placed, even if they're darned useful to others as tutors. On balance, they're more useful to society, in the long run, as nuclear engineers or lawyers, than as free, untrained tutors.Cranberrynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7691251033406320222.post-51857882039751769192010-04-07T08:07:01.841-07:002010-04-07T08:07:01.841-07:00which constitutional right did you have in mind th...<i>which constitutional right did you have in mind that guarantees a basic education?</i><br /><br />I was thinking both of what Catherine said--IDEA--and about what IDEA is based on, Brown vs. the Board of Ed. <br /><br />Let me be clear that I in no way consider myself competent to weigh in on the value of Brown or IDEA, just that right now, schools legally have to fulfill those obligations.<br /><br />If your kid is classified, you have a legal right to demand a basic education, while parents of general ed kids cannot do the same. <br /><br />But now, I'm wondering if the parents of non-remedial students could make a case, based on Brown, that their kids are not getting a basic education from the school system.Lauranoreply@blogger.com