kitchen table math, the sequel: school for horses

Friday, December 7, 2007

school for horses


Working on the horse chapter has been unnerving.

Arguably the number one animal welfare problem where horses are concerned is poor teaching. Horses are in the same predicament as U.S. children; many trainers use ineffective techniques while ignoring the techniques that actually work. Not surprisingly, the techniques that work for horses are the same techniques that work for children. Direct instruction based in learning theory.

For horses, success in school is a matter of life and death, as a horse who can't be ridden will likely be euthanized. One study in France found close to 2/3 of all domestic horses being euthanized for reasons other than ill health. (source: Equine Behaviour by Paul McGreevy A terrific book.) "Reasons other than ill health" means one of two things or both:

  • horse can't be ridden
  • horse has behavior problems

These outcomes are, in most cases, training failures although they are blamed on the horse. The parallel to children, who can also fail in two ways (failure to learn; failure to behave) is haunting.

6 comments:

Liz Ditz said...

Catherine, I'd disagree with #1 animal welfare problem is poor teaching. I'd start further back -- the failures start before training, and are based in (a) genetics (b) lifestyle (for lack of a better word from birth to age 24 months (or later).


I don't know about equestrian culture in France. I do know some about horsebreeding and the care of the young horse from birth to age 2 (or thereabouts) in California, and a little about warmbloods in Germany--let's call them young stock.

Take, for example, the recreational quarterhorse "industry" in California. The young stock are brought up in a way that is denatured at best. (Here comes the genetics: example--some of the QH breeding decisions, like selecting for a "lady foot" or the hyper-muscled type that led to HYPP being endemic, both of which lead to the horse being unrideable due to unsoundness.) While we are on genetics, let's just talk about NOT selecting for trainability or rideability (however you want to measure that) but selecting for other features. Given that most registries now permit artificial insemination, allowing one particular sire to dominate in a way that...

The Thoroughbred industry is a bit better -- until you get to the racing end of things.

I'll just say I will know a lot about my next horse's genetics and early upbringing. No stall-raised young stock for me, I'm not interested in the horse if it has never lived out of doors in a mixed age and gender band, and I'm not interested if it hasn't had some months (hopefully, years) roaming in a large pasture with uneven surfaces.


OK, rant off.

Liz Ditz said...

I should add--I agree, tremendous amount of clueless training

--the lead 'em & feed 'em brigade
--the rope flickers
--the "horse whisperers"
--"make the right thing easy and the wrong thing hard"
--psychobabble explanations with NO understanding of equine musculo -skeletal system

etc etc etc etc etc

Catherine Johnson said...

I'd start further back -- the failures start before training, and are based in (a) genetics (b) lifestyle (for lack of a better word from birth to age 24 months (or later).

Temple would be with you there, I bet!

Catherine Johnson said...

No stall-raised young stock for me, I'm not interested in the horse if it has never lived out of doors in a mixed age and gender ban

This seems to be a complete and total mess.

These are social animals; they've got to be raised with their pals.

True of cattle, too.

True of all animals as far as I can tell.

Catherine Johnson said...

The horse whisperers seem to know what they're doing (or so Temple says).

Temple also says a lot of the horse whisperers are Asperger-types; their perceptual systems are different from a typical persons (extremely fine detail perception).

The problem with the horse whisperers, according to Temple (and given what I've read, I agree) is that there's no way for most regular folk to have a clue what they're talking about.

The clicker training people seem to have figured out a way for normal human beings and normal horses to communicate (as well as for good trainers to communicate with amateurs).

Liz Ditz said...

Hmmmn. I've spent time training with Tom Dorrance (who I adored, and IMAO, was the real deal) John Lyons (who I like and respect) & Monte Roberts (who is charming and was flummoxed by our ultra-fit, opinionated warmbloods) -- I wouldn't peg any as Aspergians, nor am I.

The problem with the horse whisperers, according to Temple (and given what I've read, I agree) is that there's no way for most regular folk to have a clue what they're talking about. I agree--with a minor modification. A bona fide "horse whisperer" can see a horse flick an ear backward with a little eye squint, and immediately discern if the flick/squint sequence is (for example) (a) dislodging a fly and protecting against flying dust or (b)a dominance / threat / warning display.

perceptual systems are different from a typical persons (extremely fine detail perception). My argument would be that "typical" people can train themselves for that level of perception -- but. It takes hundreds or thousands of hours of observing horses being horses, around other horses, and then generalizing that to horse/human interactions. In other words, there's no quick fix.

I agree, for most folks coming into horseownership as adults, clicker training is a good route.

My equestrian sport is dressage. Clicker training has a place there, but if the rider doesn't have very fine bodily control...well, the clicker mumbles, so to speak.

Here's a story to illustrate:

While I was still breastfeeding my daughter, I had the opportunity to ride a dressage schoolmaster, so I could experience passage & piaffe. During one lesson, I asked him to piaffe (highly cadenced, trot in place). He didn't -- he did sort of a lame-o levade (a sort of controlled, hind-legs-crouching rear) instead, which the schoolmaster had never been trained to do. Over the next couple of days, I rode him several more times. Sometimes piaffe, sometimes the levade. The trainer and I contemplated why sometimes the one, sometimes the other. Finally, the penny dropped for me -- if I'd recently nursed, then piaffe when asked. If not, levade. HAH! I was doing something outside of my conscious awareness, mostly with my pectoral muscles but probably with the core too, to get the levade.

This is a long way round to referring back to direct instruction, Direct Instruction, and the teaching of misrules, the misteaching of rules, or you better be really clear on what you asking for, and how you are asking for it...

In other words, if you ask for X and get Y, look to the qualities of your question before you label the answer "wrong".