kitchen table math, the sequel: paying for arithmetic twice

Tuesday, July 10, 2007

paying for arithmetic twice

I'm supposed to be working (aack! aack!) but instead I'm posting this factoid:

Families spend $283 million to pay for their children’s remedial courses in community colleges alone!
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7 comments:

concernedCTparent said...

There's also a cost (a huge one) for NOT doing remediation either during K-12 or less optimally in college.... it's called missed opportunity. You cannot put a price tag on that.

July 10, 2007 at 3:23 PM
Catherine Johnson said...

That's for sure.

I'm probably a victim of that. One of my sisters is, too.

I learned practically no math in high school - and, worse, didn't know I had learned practically no math in high school.

July 10, 2007 at 3:31 PM
Barry Garelick said...

Can anyone please address the rebuttal to increasing college remediation rates, which goes something like this:

Since there are more people going to college than in the past, you have a bigger population of students who may not necessarily be as proficient in math as populations of years past. Thus, there will be a higher rate of math remediation rates.

One possible rebuttal is that if there are more students of supposedly "lower quality" how is it that they progressed through enough high school math that they qualify to take calculus their freshman year? The college math professors I've spoken with note that students in these classes have a difficult time with algebraic/symbolic manipulation and also of basics such as fractions. One professor I know has students who wish to major in math and are stymied by the concept of proof. The population thesis doesn't really get at that very well in my opinion.

July 11, 2007 at 5:53 AM
Catherine Johnson said...

I think I have one of the best sources, but where the heck is it?

IT's an Education Next article showing that the argument that SAT scores declined due to more people taking the test was wrong, because their was decline at the top, too.

Actually, that's probably the key word to use.

It's going to be the same for community colleges, too.

July 11, 2007 at 11:07 AM
Catherine Johnson said...

In fact, I would simply memorize the phrase "decline at the top."

July 11, 2007 at 11:07 AM
Barry Garelick said...

"Decline at the top" GOT IT. "Decline at the top, the line at the mop, the sine of the cop",uh oh, what did she say again? Gotta stop reading the TERC manual at breakfast.

July 12, 2007 at 4:59 AM
Anonymous said...

Since there are more people going to college than in the past, you have a bigger population of students who may not necessarily be as proficient in math as populations of years past. Thus, there will be a higher rate of math remediation rates.

This is possible. But ... speaking to a college system I'm sorta familiar with ...

The Cal State University (CSU ... not to be confused with the UC system) aims to admit the top 1/3 of California high school graduates (UC aims for top 12.5% ... both take out-of-state students, too).

CSU requires for admission at least three years of high school math (algebra, geometry, alg2).

So ... top 1/3 (although on average probably the bottom 1/2 of that top 1/3) and at least three years of math (with a C average or better in each class). So, what percentage of accepted students need to take remedial math?

In 2001, 46% of the incoming freshmen had to take remedial math.

One can, I suppose, argue that this is higher than in the past because more students are going to college, but I have a problem with ~50% of the students in the 66%-82% percentile (bottom half of the top third!) that have taken AND PASSED THREE YEARS OF HIGH SCHOOL MATH, still needing to be remediated.

[N.B. The math remediation rate is up a *LOT* from 1989 ... 23% back then versus a bit under 50% today ... I don't think this can be explained by "more students going to college"]

-Mark Roulo






CSU entrance requirements here: http://powayusd.sdcoe.k12.ca.us/news/college/a-g-requirements.htm

"Top 1/3" from memory, but also confirmed by Wikipedia.

Remdial math rate from here: http://lao.ca.gov/analysis_2003/education/hied_08_6610_anl03.htm

More CSU remediation data here:
http://www.asd.calstate.edu/performance/proficiency.shtml
There might be a demographic change, too.

July 13, 2007 at 6:10 PM

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